he wants tax credits and spending subsidies. >> this is not what with tax cuts to higher people -- >> i will ask you about when he talks about energy he is not talking about fraking or shale. he is talking about more green energy spending. that's the difference between him and clinton. >> appreciate that. what i'm saying is if you don't like the same as it ever was, let's have a conversation about the bush years if we are going to talk about what worked and didn't work, bush's policies did not work. if you don't believe me, look at the 4.5 million jobs. >> what do you mean? >> 2008 until january 2009, we lost 4.5 million jobs. >> do you know over the same time span that bush created more jobs. the bush recovery created more jobs than the obama -- >> what was -- >> even though the recession was much milder,crea more jobs than obama did. using the obama metric. listen, i know this is stunning because you watch the democratic national convention and heard those numbers over and other own. over the same time period. >> here's where i got my facts. >> let me finish. >> go ahead. >> over th